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Interview with Mary Catherine Pickett Smith

Citation

Please feel free to use the information from this transcript in any scholarly work. The full citation for this document is : Mary Catherine Pickett Smith, interview by Nikki Smith, October 12, 1997, OH002, Oral History Collection, Frederick Community College, Frederick, MD.

Abstract

Mary Catherine Smith, formerly Mary Catherine Pickett was born on June 22, 1920. During her study in junior high school she decides to become a nurse. After graduation, she was trained at St. Joseph's nursing school in Fort Wayne, Indiana. She graduates in 1941, the same year when war between Germany and United States is declared. A year later, in June 1942, she gets involved into service and is assigned to White Sulfur Springs, West Virginia. There she takes care of German and Italian prisoners. In February 1944, she is sent to Europe, where major battles of World War II took place. There she is joined with thirty-fifth evacuation hospital. During that period Catherine experiences inhumane conditions of war, but more that that she faces death face to face. World War II changes her life completely. She becomes a different person, she doesn't have to have a lot to be appreciative. She is happy as long as she has her "simple necessities." After the war was ended, she returns home and starts a family. In this interview she shares with her experiences of World War II and discusses about herself and the reality of war that she experienced as a combat nurse.

Transcript

NS = Nikki Smith (interviewer)
MPS = Mary Pickett Smith (interviewee)
ES = Eugene Smith (Mary's husband)

NS:	Today is Sunday, October 12, 1997. I'm talking to Mary Catherine Smith, formerly Mary Catherine Pickett. She was a nurse in the thirty-fifth evacuation hospital during World War II. Her tour of duty was July 1, 1943 to the February 2, 1946. Okay, first can I have your birthday?
MPS:	June the 22, 1920.
NS:	What age were you when you decided to become a nurse? And what made you want to become a nurse?
MPS:	What age...?
ES:	What age were you when you decided to go to nursing school and why did you want to go?
MPS:	Oh, okay, this isn't about the service, right now, right?
NS:	No. Just a little background.
MPS:	I made my decision to go to nursing school when I was a junior in high school. And the following June, I graduated in June and, July the, I think it was July the first, I went into nurses' training at St. Joseph's nursing school in Fort Wayne (Indiana). And then I, from that point, I, don't know if youwant any details of my nursing or regular training. And then I graduated in 1941. And that fall was when war was declared, so then I didn't go in until, didn't go in to the service until 1942, and that was in, let's see, it probably was, it probably was in June 1942 and I was assigned to White Sulfur Springs, West Virginia. I had absolutely no military training whatsoever. Everything was moving so fast and it was, and I didn't even have an army uniform. I was still in civilian clothes. And then I, while I was there I did, I worked on the medical floor for a very short time. And then I took care of the German and Italian prisoners. And some very happy people said they were prisoners because they were having good food, they had a nice place to sleep, getting good medical care and they were just happy. They sang all the time, especially the Italians. And those that were able to do some work, work around on the grounds of the, of the hospital, pick up paper and scraps and trim the bushes and that kind of stuff. And all the while they did that, they did nothing but sing. They were very very happy. And then I worked in the orthopedic ward, when I got word that I was supposed to go overseas. And I think that was in February (1944) when we, when we left. You have all that information in that book there. Let's see... What they don't tell you is how we traveled, how we went over on the Queen Mary, and we had, all the cabins were fixed for the military. And I think there was two, there were about eight berths fixed up per room that I was in. And we had smooth sailing, but I got seasick all the way over, believe it or not. And then we went, and they had entertainment on the, on the ship there, because we had a U.S.O. crew. I never got to see any of that because I was dead, very miserable. And then I went, we landed in Scotland. And by that time I wasn't able to eat all this time, and I was weak as a cat. We had to put on my uniform, and they put the pack on me, and I was shaking so bad, I couldn't get, hardly get down the gangplank, which was only, only the...what, shoot, what they call it? The gangplank itself? And just a skimpy rope that you could hold on to the side and I thought I was never going to make it. So, we got into Scotland and we waited around and we, finally they, the Red Cross was there and they gave doughnuts and coffee, this kind of thing and we finally got on a train, an English train, and we didn't, we didn't know where were going, we were just going someplace. So we landed, ended up in Stone, England. And they had a militant guest, the individual homes, the people that lived there in that town, if they had a bed or two empty, why they would put up the soldiers, nurses, and doctors in these places. And we stayed there until June, and uh... we were sent to different schools during this. Time. Oh, you know they didn't let, both the enlisted men and the officers and nurses were sent to different schools. Whether it was surgical, or medical or whatever, and then we were moved to Southern England, and we stayed there just a few days, then we were put on a ship and we, after, after D-Day (June 6, 1944), and 16 days after D-Day, I believe, and we went across the English Channel and landed in France. I stayed up all that time ?cause I didn't want to get seasick again. And I stayed up on top deck where the wind could hit my face. So needless to say, when I got to France, I was just exhausted. I mean to the point where I laid down in the dirt, and my face was in the dirt and I went to sleep. And we had this big hill to climb and there was shooting going on...
NS:	Oh, wow...
MPS:	And, I wasn't, I had no fear at that, this time yet. As we moved on into France, we were close to Sherbet. As you're going though this town, one of the MP's directing traffic was killed by a sniper, and I still at this time hadn't gotten scared. So then we finally had a place out in the field and we were connected at that time with the hundred and first evac. hospital until we could get stabilized. They were digging holes for graves to bury people in. And it was all chaos and everything's all mixed up. Well then, the fourth of July, the day of 4th July, they were fighting, and, and where we were the bullets were going over our heads. And the bombs, and the, the, the, ground actually shook. And this went on all day. And that was when I first realized I was in, in a danger spot. You know it sounds silly, but I didn't have any fear until that time. And that things were serious. Then we, finally, joined Patton's third army and we had our own little trail to go, because wherever he moved, we moved. Just so, we were back far enough behind him we wouldn't be hurt. A lot of times at night we'd have air raids. The planes are coming over and so there were trenches that were dug for the nurses and we had five nurses to a tent and they had, I can't remember if we had, yeah, we must've had two fox holes for the five of us on either side of our tent. And one night the planes bearing down and they yelled for alert and they, all the nurses jumped in these trenches, you know. That was a little scary. And then after it was all over, we all crawled into beds, but they didn't drop any bombs or anything. From that point on, I first did general surgery. And uh... after we moved on I did maxiofacial surgery. Those patients were mostly from, men that were caught in these tanks that were on fire. Honey, (to Eugene) get me some water, will you? Tanks that were caught on fire and they couldn't get out and it was a mess. So, I finally had to ask to get off of that type of surgery, because after a while everything I ate, to me smelt like burned flesh and I mean, I had to get out. It's the only answer. So then, from there I went to brain surgery, and I don't know if that was much better but, but it wasn't smelly, you know. It was very serious. I've seen men laying on the table, I could, their brains just falling to the floor. I mean they were shot in the head and it was just pathetic, you know. And then we'd have cases where they were awake while we did their surgery. But anyway, wherever we went, you see the surgical unit was always set up first. So, we were always the first to go to work. And then we had a ward unit and they, they were always the last, you know, to, if we were on the move, they were always the last to get out. So, every place we went, we had patients already there waiting. And some nights we worked twelve-hour shifts, seven to seven. One week days, next week on nights. Then when we were ready to move, surgery was the first to shut down. So, that gave the surgery crew, to, you know, sort of catch up on themselves, as far as doing your laundry and cleaning up and maybe getting a little rest and, but the wards were always busy, very busy and they were trying to ship their patients back to a general hospital or a station. So, then we were on a move again and the same thing went over and over. They, the day we, oh I'm ahead of myself. On August the fourth (1944), we were on the move and for some reason, we, somebody gave the wrong directions. And then we were convoyed up to the front and we were by some very important bridges, and the Germans were trying to bomb those bridges. All the nurses were in ambulances when they moved. And they split us up, so that if we got hit, it wouldn't kill all the nurses at once. So, I happened to be in the very first ambulance that was in this convoy and, finally, it got so bad, they stopped and they told us to hit the ditch, which we did and my knees were shaking so bad, that when I got off that last step of the ambulance, I fell right on my face. I mean, I was just really shaking. But anyway, everything seemed to cool down a little bit and we got out of that place. But I'll never forget August the fourth. Every time it comes that time... So, then we went into, well we went into France, and from France we went to Luxembourg. And uh...we stayed there quite a while and we, they had, the Germans had those railroad guns, where they'd bring them in every night, there was blasting all the time. We had a lot of patients in there. That was a beautiful little city. When we did have free time, we could roam around a little bit. But we had to be careful because you never knew, you couldn't just go roam around alone, because there might be a German or somebody around. So, we stayed there. When we first came there, it was all mud from water and dripping rain, you know. And we would walk from our, we were in a, the nurses were in a building and it was, oh, maybe a block or a block and a half from the hospital. And, so we'd have to walk over to the hospital. We had on our high boots and the mud was so thick, that we'd soon look down, and we'd pull our foot up and the boot would stay in, and we'd have there was our foot. We'd have to put our foot back in the boot, and try to get the boot loose, and keep walking that way. I mean, I never saw so much mud in my life. And it was all churned up because of the ambulances coming in and out, and the two and half-ton trucks. So, we stayed there until, well it was winter because there was a lot of snow and it was cold. Even though we were busy, I felt real good about Luxembourg for some reason. And from there we went on to Germany, and I remember when we crossed the Rhine river, we started out real early in the morning and we, the nurses were traveling in a two and a half ton truck. And sometimes, I bet, we wouldn't move more than a foot. I mean, the traffic was that bad. Finally, when we did get to the river, it was a pontoon bridge. I'd never seen one, you know, it was something different. But they were just, you know, one by one and going across. We didn't get there until late that evening to where, where we were set up. And there were so many patients. Now this was during the worst part of the war. There were so many patients and when we got there, we, we had to step over bodies to get, to get to our surgery, there was that many. And I was supposed to go to work on days. Yeah, I was supposed to go to work on days. And I was just getting ready to go to bed because it was late. What am I saying that for anyway? Anyway, I wasn't supposed to go to work. I was just getting ready to crawl in bed and they told us every nurse available had to into surgery. We worked all night long and we were so exhausted, that we got silly. You know when you get gilly, giddy...
NS:	Oh, yeah...
MPS:	And we worked all night. And they, so then I really, I really was supposed to go on to work at seven, but they let me, let us go home and sleep a few hours. Then we had to go back and get our shift in order again. So, it was, it was quite a serious, pathetic thing, and, and, and these guys were so patient, laying there shot, moaning, hurting so bad and, and it took so long for us to get them off to the surgery. But we finally managed. So, that was very outstanding to me. In the spring (1945) we were in Germany and the air was mellow and nice, you know, we went in the sun, if it were winter. And uh... we were in a very lovely place and we went for a walk, and there was a huge ditch that was dug out, and it was all German soldiers laying dead in this ditch. And every once in a while, what would happen was they'd bring them in at night. They kept putting them in this ditch. They were going to cover it over. But anyway, every once in a while, you could see packets of cigarettes sticking out of their pockets, like Lucky Strikes. But you know they got them from a dead American.
NS:	Right.
MPS:	That was, that was sad for me. I, I would have been all right if I hadn't seen all that. But, anyway, we stayed there and we were in, then Christmas one year we were doing good. We were in a great big factory with no windows. They served us a really nice dinner, by the time you found a place to sit, your, your meal was cold. So, these places that we'd be in, well like in the wintertime and in the snow, and this type of thing, we were in buildings. Now the buildings may not have any windows or anything in them, but at least we were in a building, not on the ground. And they would try to put up army blankets and get a pot bellied stove going so your shower and so forth. Now this is a big room and everybody's taking a bath, so you forget all about modesty. When we'd go to bed at night, if we'd spilt any water on the floor, it was ice when we'd get up. I mean it was cold. So, we went through some rough times, but I, none of us ever really felt bad, because we were all in the same situation. And, you know, there wasn't anybody getting anything better than what we were getting. So, you know, and I used to get letters from my mother and she'd be worrying about me and I'd say why is she worried about me, you know, I'm alright, I'm not hurt, I'm living, I got good health. And sort of we got tired of the spams with cheese and this kind of stuff, but they had heat sometimes, you know. So, at the time I really didn't feel like I was, I felt like I was doing some good, but I didn't feel like I was anything special, you know, because we were all doing it. And it, and there were a lot of nice times during the war, you know, like maybe we were all shut down for a move. Maybe we didn't move for a day or two, even though we were really ready, why then we'd have, we'd have parties, you know. And we dressed in fatigues, like the men, by the way, and had the combat boots. And you'd be surprised how nice you can dance in combat boots on the grass or the ground, if you've got a little music. Anyway, it wasn't always bad. And in fact people that have, people that we were with are the best friends I have as of today. And we still have a reunion, you know, and get together. It's just wonderful, it's just like family. Some of the disadvantages that we had was a lot of times all we had was our helmets to take a bath in. And so you put in a little water, and you take your bath, then you wash your underwear in it. Because that's all you had, we were short of water. But everybody had to do this. So like I said, I didn't feel bad. In France, we had lots and lots of rain. And many, many times I'd put on my underwear and it's still wet. It never dried. So, those are the little things. Of course, when you shampoo your hair out of a helmet, somebody else pours water over it to rinse it. Everybody just worked together, that's all there was to it. It's really nice. I don't know, do you have any questions that you want, want me to ask, or, or that you want to ask me that I can answer now?
NS:	Well, what, what for you was the hardest thing for you to deal with, that happened while you were over seas?
MPS:	The hardest thing that happened to me? Well... morale wise it was mail, when the mail didn't get through. That was, of course, that was for morale. I guess... I don't know. I think the hardest thing was to see people suffering and, and to have young men so hail and harvey and healthy and come in and a leg or something all torn up. And that used to get to me. And the fact that we, we never took care of anybody that was old, and everybody that was over there, always the young people that were being injured. And I think that upset me a lot. Because they had their whole lives ahead of them. I mean, I know, especially with my brain surgery, I know some of them will never be normal again. And that, that hurts and not only for the individual, but for their family and their friends and so forth. I think that was about the hardest thing. Do you have anything else you want to ask me?
NS:	Just, like, what was your, your typical day like? Like getting up or, and going to surgery. How many patients would you see in a day?
MPS:	Well, the first thing we did in the morning, of course, we got cleaned up and dressed, and, like I said, we were in combat clothes. We went to chow and a lot of times a lot our food was dried food and C-Rations, K-Rations. But then, if possible, they would try to get decent food to us. You know, like, the simple thing as eggs, a lot of times we wouldn't have eggs for months. Then all of a sudden we'd get eggs and we, when we got them allowed three a piece. So, it was a... and from there you went directly to duty and as soon as you went to work, why it was three twelve hour right straight through. We, we had two tables we operated with. And I set, get someone set up on the first table all ready for surgery and, and the doctor and the technicians would take over from that on, that time and do the surgery. While they're doing that and if anything they need, why I run and get it. But while they were doing that, they'd bring in somebody else on the second table. I'd prepare them for the, for the doctor and the technicians. So, this goes on all day. And since they're done with one patient, they get scrubbed up and go do the other one. And other patients are bought in on the litter. So, I, I really can't tell you, I think maybe in that book, it might tell you about an average of how many patients we did a day. I just know it was a steady twelve-hour work
NS:	Okay.
MPS:	And we'd take time off to, you know, like if we were working days we took time off for our lunch. And also our, well we usually had our dinner after seven o'clock shift would end. So, it was a pretty, pretty well accounted thing. It wasn't something that you sit around and waited. It was working all day.
NS:	Right.
MPS:	Thank God I did it then, because if I had to do it now, I couldn't. But that's why young people are in the war. I mean, it, it's a constant thing. And we didn't have to do much lifting because they had ward men that come in and, and took, brought the patients in and took them out. So, this part wasn't heavy for us. It was just the constant work was very, very heavy.
ES:	How, how did you feel when the war ended?
MPS:	Well, this always surprises me, because I understand back in the States, they just celebrated like mad, you know, whistles, parades, parties, so on. We were just happy it was over. And, and, I'll tell you one thing that upset us was when President Roosevelt died. Because we didn't know how things were going to go and it, it, people were really concerned about that. Even me, and I'm not a Democrat. But everybody was wondering with him gone, what's going to happen, you know? But of course it worked out all right. But I, I'm off the track. What was I talking about before?
ES:	How you felt when the war ended.
MPS:	Oh! How we felt. We were happy, but there wasn't any celebration. We just, everybody was just happy, but nobody celebrated. And, and that's why I say, it struck me so funny that everybody went crazy here in the States. Well, of course, all their loved one's were over there.
NS:	Right.
MPS:	So, and, and we were still getting patients. See it was just another day with good news. Because we were still do, getting patients in. In fact, even after the war, we got a lot of pathetic patients because some of the guys that were up in front, had more freedom and they'd get in terrible jeep accidents, they'd get killed. They would drink liquor that was poisoned. Some of them were blind, totally blind after it was all over. And so we'd, you know, we still had a pretty heavy schedule. But not as heavy as actual combat. Okay.
NS:	After the war was over, what, what did, what did you do?
MPS:	What did I what?
NS:	What did you do or...
MPS:	What did, you mean after I got home? Or what?
NS:	Yeah.
MPS:	Or, or. You mean while I was still over there?
NS:	While you were over there and after that when you came home.
MPS:	Oh. Well, when I came home the first thing we did, when we landed, they took us to a, a mess hall and we had, see we didn't have these foods at all. We had a half a head of lettuce and a great big stake and all the milk you wanted. And I tell you it was wonderful. We had no stakes, and we had no milk. And it was just, and like the lettuce and stuff. I know, I was walking in a little town in Germany one time and right next to the walk, they had, somebody had a little garden with green beans. And I stole some green beans and ate them raw because they tasted so good. It was something green, you know. So, anyway, we were very elated to have, have this meal. We were not allowed to use the telephone until after mess. The mess line was so long, and I saw telephone and I went over to that booth and I called my mother. And I told her I was home. Well...I got to wait a minute...
NS:	Okay, take your time.
MPS:	Shoot... Well, anyway, then I was processed and I was, I was out of the service. And I called my mom. I said, "Mom, I gonna, I'm gonna delay coming home a couple days because one of my nurse friends was already home and she was living in New Hampshire and I wanted to go see her because I never, I have no idea when I'll ever see her again. So, I took the train and went up to see her for two or three days, then I came home. And I came home in style. I paid a ticket for a roomette on the train. I had my own little bed, toilet, all this and that. Porter came in and woke me up, time enough to get dressed. And then I got to Fort Wayne, called a cab, walked in the house, because then we never locked our door, just walked in. And I don't know. This is getting to me... Anyway...
NS:	If you, if you want to stop, we can stop.
MPS:	I don't know, it just brings back some memories, I guess. Anyway, I was so happy to be home. Well, then I, I did industrial nursing and also worked in the nursery when I, after I got home. And then I met Gene and that did it, we got married. Raised six children.
NS:	Yup.
MPS:	We're all healthy. We were healthy. You know, basically I've had a very good life. I, I wouldn't give up that experience for anything in the world. It, it made me value life and to appreciate what I have. And also, I don't have to have a lot to be appreciative, to appreciate it. As long as I've got the bare necessities, I'm happy. And I think a lot of that is because of the war. And it's, and also I got a lot of that from my mom. She was like that, so. So, I don't know, do you want, do you have another question or...
NS:	Oh, I think I'm finished.
MPS:	You think you're finished?
NS:	Yeah, I think you've answered everything that I needed to know.
MPS:	Okay.
NS:
MPS:	Well, that's all right. Did you put tears in there?
NS:	Yes, I did, I'll be sure to say tears.
MPS:	Yeah, it's, you know, it's sometimes, I don't like to talk about a lot of stuff. Maybe it's because I get too emotional. So, I'm sorry I blubbered over a couple times, but anyway.
NS:	You really don't have to apologize.
MPS:	Well, I guess not, maybe I don't, but it, it, I hope this is enough information. I hope I've told you the most important things that happened. I think I left out a lot of stuff because a lot of it's in that book I gave you.
NS:	Yeah.
MPS:	You know and some of the nurses and enlisted men were married while they were over there. But you just couldn't go, get married. You had to have a lot, lot of papers and, you know.
ES:	A lot of red tape.
MPS:	Lot of red tape, yeah, in the service. And spiritual wise, we had a Methodist minister with us and as a result why whenever, and he was a lovely man, but whenever a priest would come by, why they would send out a notice, you know, or, you know, everybody knew the priest was here and he was going to have mass at such and such a time. And it was so beautiful because it would be outside and maybe he'd use a trunk of a tree to make his altar. And there, of course, there's no benches, you stood or knelt, you know in, or on the ground and this is very important for the enlisted men and the officers, nurses, that we could have, you know, got go to church. I think at that time, when you're in the line of danger, I think you find a lot of people there in church, that normally you wouldn't see. If that makes sense to you.
NS:	No, it does.
MPS:	Yeah, yeah. So there's a, you know there's a lot of little things that happened, you know, that were happy and some of them were, weren't so happy. So, I think basically, most, most of it's in the book, and what I have told you.
NS:	Well, thank you for telling me about this. I, I do appreciate it.
MPS:	Yeah, well, that's fine and you know what? The more I think about it, you may just want to keep that book for yourself. You know I'm not going to be here forever.
NS:	Yeah, well.
MPS:	That just might be a nice thing to keep. I know if my grandmother was in something like that, I probably would like to want to keep it. My grandmother once was in a covered wagon and went on as far as St. Louis. And she used to tell me these stories and I never wrote them down. And I'm so sorry I didn't. So, you know this may be something you might want to keep.
NS:	That's a, that's another reason why I'm glad that I'm interviewing you.
MPS:	Yeah.
NS:	Because, it's something that, I've heard you tell some stories about it, but not a lot.
MPS:	Yeah.
NS:	And I just really wanted to know and...
MPS:	Well, I know something else that you probably... The nurses, we lost all our privacy. When we'd first get in a place, in, if it wasn't put up, you know, sometimes there'd be a crew that'd go ahead and get this place ready, okay? If a lot of times when we'd get there, all it would be, would be a little trench dug in the ground and a, and four sides of a tent put up. And that's where we used to go into... go to the toilet. And you straddled that trench and went to the toilet. Now that is fun. You know, it's just little things, so many little things like that. And when they, then when they did build a, a pinch, you know, you know that we could go to the toilet, well then, they had a box seats that we could sit on. I don't think that there were any backs on them.
NS:	Uh huh...
MPS:	And I imagine there were at least six of them, maybe there were, by that, longer than that. But anyway, you maybe sitting in there with six people going to the toilet and taking care of the, your monthly little visits, you know. You lost all your modesty. I can tell you that right at the beginning. Then they had a shower put up for us. And it just had the four sides. And we, somebody found out about it, and the planes used to go over and look at, see if they could see the nurses taking a shower. No, it was, it was an altogether different world.
NS:	I guess so.
MPS:	So, I don't know... Those are some little stories you can remember from your grandmother.
NS:	Well, I definitely will.
MPS:	Yeah. Yeah. And if you think of anything else you want to know, you can feel free to call me.
NS:	Oh, I will.
MPS:	Or write or whatever you want to do.
NS:	I will.
MPS:	Okay, sounds good.